The Art of Influencer Outreach with Jake Kitchiner

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Ever wondered how to pitch influencers?

Well this is the episode for you. Jake Kitchiner is co-founder of Channel Crawler - a leading influencer YouTube discovery tool. In this conversation, Jake explains why a personalized outreach is the cornerstone of successful brand-influencer partnerships. He also shares advice on how brands should approach different stages of the marketing funnel when working with influencers.

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Previous guests include: Arvid Kahl of FeedbackPanda, Andrei Zinkevich of FullFunnel, Scott Van den Berg of Influencer Capital, Buster Franken of Fruitpunch AI, Valentin Radu of Omniconvert, Evelina Necula of Kinderpedia, Ionut Vlad of Tokinomo, Diana Florescu of MediaforGrowth, Irina Obushtarova of Recursive, Monika Paule of Caszyme, Yannick Veys of Hypefury, Laura Erdem of Dreamdata, and Pija Indriunaite of CityBee.

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Transcript

Eric (00:02.784)
Meanwhile, how's the weather over there and where you're at?

Jake Kitchiner (00:06.543)
We have had some great weather until probably like today where the sun is just kind of starting to go away. I personally, I love summer. I just think everyone in the UK is so much happier. There's so much more zest alive. People are like, you know, want to go and do things. And so, yeah, it's a really good, good, good time. And there's cricket on us as well, but we're just, just coming to the end of that now. You know, we've had Wimbledon, Olympics is gone.

sort of back into the start of football season and the end of cricket. yeah, it's changing at the tides, not quite yet, but yeah, just about to end all the festivals soon.

Eric (00:43.207)
Yeah, cool, cool. All right. Jake, welcome to Innovators Can Laugh. How you doing today?

Jake Kitchiner (00:48.14)
I'm doing very well, awesome to be here. Thanks for having me.

Eric (00:50.843)
Yeah, of course. You know, the first question I have for you, I mean, as an entrepreneur, what was the first entrepreneurial thing you did as a kid? Like, did you ever go door -to -door selling kitchen knives or anything like that?

Jake Kitchiner (01:02.958)
I've done some door to door selling in the past and I can you it's a tough experience. But my first one was I actually used to be the tuck shop at school. So because of bad behavior by some of the kids around by the tuck shop area, it was actually shut down for about six months. And so I saw a gap in the market and basically on my way home from football training on Friday nights, my dad would pop into Tesco's or a similar

shop with me and we just go and buy like multi packs of chocolate and other sweets and I would take them in my bag the next day and then start selling them to the other kids. But it got so big I became like really well known so I had to take like more than one bag to school when I started going to places like Costco to get them and even made a deal with the local shop to get me cans of drink for cheap as well. so yeah, eventually by the end of the year it's quite stressful but it was a lot.

A lot of good fun and I just, love listening to people like what was, what was selling, what wasn't, how I could get the best prices and like how I could get more people around the school to know who I was without getting in trouble from the teachers, of course. So that was my first experience and I loved it.

Eric (02:12.039)
You

Eric (02:17.713)
Yeah, I imagine you can't really do this openly, so you're kind of like a drug dealer, like, hey, come here, come here, I got something for you.

Jake Kitchiner (02:23.98)
Yeah, yeah, literally like that. Like, you know, I get to classes early and teachers think, he's got a great kid. But actually, I just knew that people knew that I was in their class and they wanted to buy things. And so some teachers did find out the PE teacher was brought off with fruit pastels. So that was totally fine. Other ones just sort of, you know, pretended they didn't. But yeah, it was interesting. It definitely got hairy towards the end of the year. And I did stop a few weeks out from finishing, but it was all good, all good fun.

Eric (02:33.457)
Yeah, yeah. Did you ever give any kids credit? Like, okay, I'll give it to you now, but you know, you me or anything like that.

Eric (02:51.899)
All right, all right, very, very cool. Well, we're to dive into Channel Crawler, but before we do that, any other major startups that you had tried to launch but failed before you created Channel Crawler?

Jake Kitchiner (03:03.638)
Yeah, I've had a few ideas along the way. I think the one that I put quite a bit of time in the most recently was one that was going to be called Green Bee Living. I still have the domain, should that idea ever come to fruition again. But essentially trying to help people do green living. that's not just in telling people, you you should be green, you should do this. But actually, there's a lot of choices that we make as consumers that we don't know which one would be the greenest to choose.

And so I wanted to have a website, know, YouTube channel and all of those things where it just, just made those things like really simple. Like if this is your scenario, this is the one that you would choose. Like if you've got open options, like choose this one, but most people don't, most people don't have all of the facilities that they, they need to make certain green decisions. so simply simple example, can just be around the dog waste bag that you choose. Lots of people choose a compostable one, but because it's got dog waste in it, no one's composting that.

unless you've got a really specific area. So just things like that. But I was doing it part -time trying to build. I'd gotten some good inventory. I'd started to get some feedback and insights from potential customers. But the setup of an Amazon store and all of those things is one thing. Then you've got to get your brand build and then find all of these products and source multiple ones as well.

I super interested in set up and learning about like branding and how all of these different online stores worked and Shopify, et cetera. But the reason I didn't pursue it was essentially because what I'm doing now, the opportunity came up as I was a few months into all of that. And I was like, actually, this is a great place that I can go and take this new opportunity on. But I've always had like some different kind of ideas somewhere that's going on in the back of my mind. It's just a case of like, how do we bring that to life?

Eric (04:53.041)
Yeah, very, very cool. Very cool. Now, usually let's get into channel crawler. I want to know, what was the idea or the thought in your head that, there's a gap in the market for this and I'm going to be the one to actually solve it? When did that occur? What were you thinking?

Jake Kitchiner (05:07.874)
Yeah, awesome. there's, there's three, three co -founders within the business. There's the person who originally built the tool and it was all, all his ideas. So I don't, don't take credit for that. He's a content creator. He, his content helped other YouTube channels grow and he started it to find like collaborations for, you know, for YouTubers for himself, but also for, for others.

Me and my other co -founder both kind of found channel crawl in the same way as I was looking for ideas on content of how I could do something for this green bee living idea. He was looking for something in finance for similar, and we couldn't find something to just help us find YouTubers. so through various different methodologies, we kind of all came together and the tool had been built. was there. We knew it had some users come along and use it, but we knew we could make it much better. We knew we could get lots more YouTubers on there.

give them filters for people to find them to make them actually usable and get the influences not just in their niche, but how they're performing via certain KPIs and in the regions that they want to. And then can we actually put that messaging across to users and say, this is why you should be using YouTubers. This is why you need a tool to save you time. And actually that was all quite good because people were already looking for that anyway.

I'd love to take the credit and say I had this brilliant idea and I came up with it, but I was just a consumer with a problem and someone had solved it and I wanted to help more people set it to solve it in future.

Eric (06:30.353)
Hahaha

Eric (06:34.801)
Yeah, what do brands like most about it? What is that one thing that they discover and they feel like this is indispensable and we're going to continue using this tool?

Jake Kitchiner (06:43.986)
I think there's a couple of things with it. think the fact that it's YouTube focused and activations with brands and influencers in long form content is different to short form. There's advantages to both, but YouTube is the go -to platform for that long form content. so if you, as a brand, take somebody like Wix, for example, you want to do a walkthrough of a platform of an influencer who's known for building websites, building businesses.

you know, that person has a lot of value and they have a lot of time to show and sell that product with an audience that's already there looking at this type of content, which just isn't quite able to do in the same way with, you know, a TikTok, cetera. But of course, you know, there'd be other reasons why you would go and use TikTok and TikTok shop is obviously amazing. And I think the other side is just the preffer of YouTubers because we're really focused on adding more YouTubers to our database and making more discoverable all around the world. It's just, there's always someone for you to find and always someone for you to partner with.

no matter what your brand campaign is or if YouTube is your customer, there's always somebody that you can find that's right for you. And I think they're the two key things for us. We want to be known as the best YouTuber discovery tool in the world. And it's YouTube focused and there's more YouTubers in there than any other platform. So that's kind of where we double down and focus.

Eric (07:56.347)
Yeah, what's one of the most weird creators that you've seen with an audience on YouTube? Any come to mind?

Jake Kitchiner (08:03.778)
Well, I feel like I'm really late to the party on this, but I didn't realize that chess boxing was a thing. So it's actually people get into the ring box and then play chess and it's all one. And I just went down the rabbit hole like quite recently. I've only just found out about like, this is a whole thing. There's a whole sport around it people go and, but I was just, it just blew my mind. I was like, this is, this is amazing. Like I've never thought to do it, but now I can't think of anything else.

Eric (08:11.067)
Yeah. Yeah.

Eric (08:29.437)
I know. mean, most, I was going to say it's mostly nerds who play chess, but you can't have an, you can't be a nerd chess boxer. I just don't think that that's going to happen. Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe I'm totally wrong, but I feel like the, these people with their chess acumen is not as good as really good chess players because they have to get physical and they have to throw punches. Am I right or no?

Jake Kitchiner (08:52.332)
Well, I think so. And it has to be like a real level of intelligence as well, because chess is such a skill, skillful game. I, I like playing chess, but as soon as I play with anybody who's got any like real talent with it, like I'm beating hands down. If you've just learned the rules, I can probably beat you. Otherwise I'm going to lose. But obviously they're doing that. And then also going to, to punch someone in the face. So think I'd lose the chess game and lose the boxing.

Eric (09:17.149)
Well, how does it work? Is it three minutes like playing chess and then three minutes fighting? What are the normal rules?

Jake Kitchiner (09:25.162)
I don't know what all of the exact rules are for each like different format. But yeah, you basically you're alternating between the two different ones. And so someone might punch you in the head one minute and you're taking their queen the next and it's just bizarre overall. But it's something I want to watch more of and start to get and understand like some of the nuances it and how somebody like steps into that arena as well because I

Eric (09:46.983)
You

Jake Kitchiner (09:49.226)
I didn't do boxing as a kid, but there was a chess club at school and I just didn't see those people that were playing chess or my friends that play chess as being people that would box as well. So I'm kind of interested in the psyche behind it. Like how do you get into it and start that?

Eric (10:04.669)
Yeah, yeah, it is fascinating. Now that you think about it, I've read about it before. I've never seen a match or a game, but now that you talk about it, I'm intrigued to go to YouTube and maybe look it up and just see a few matches. Even if it's like 10 minutes, I bet it's so thrilling to see somebody get beat on the chessboard, but then he has this other opportunity to make up for it in boxing. So I'll check it out. Yeah.

Jake Kitchiner (10:16.77)
Yeah, people have got thousands and thousands of subscribers and thousands of views.

Jake Kitchiner (10:30.775)
Yeah.

Eric (10:31.697)
Yeah, okay. So I have a question for you. What's some advice that you have for clients or brands that are trying to connect with influencers and they're trying to reach out to them. They're trying to pitch them their brand about working with them. Is there some things that you've seen work and some things that don't work?

Jake Kitchiner (10:34.231)
Hmm.

Jake Kitchiner (10:48.854)
Yeah. So I think there's, there's, there's two things that I would always think about with this. Like, we were often contacted most by, by, by startups who haven't gone through this, this process before. because a lot of, like brands and other customers will come onto the platform and have done influencer marketing. And so they're using it to discover influence, but some people might want a bit of support and help. And I think in that early stage, like before you've even started your discovery is like, think about who is.

as a company, who is your ideal customer profile? And really, really think about that because it's, it's not just somebody in a specific type of, of niche, right? So in terms of like, if you're like a fitness creator, right? Not all fitness creators are going to be right for you because there might be a certain type of customer, like in fitness, I like to think that I'm fit, but I'm fit for running. and kind of cricket maybe.

So I would look at, somebody talking about running shoes, how to get more more stamina, how to perform better in marathons. That's very different to a fitness influencer who's talking about bulking and doing stuff in the gym. And when you've got a product that could technically be bought by quite a wide set of customer profile, you want to think about the one that you're really targeting. And then when you come to do your discovery, it's then about, okay, like,

what type of creator is going to have an engaged audience that would talk about this subject and start to look at those particular tags. So if I'm me, I'm looking for people that are talking about, you know, running, running shoes, triathlons, biathlons, marathons, those types of things, because it helps me step into a new audience. So I'm a runner. Could I be interested in doing biathlon, triathlon? Maybe. So I get a new audience. Is that the person I'm trying to reach or do I want to go specific into running? And so now I've...

Now I'm pretty confident I can start to use a tool like Channel Crawler to search for my, my YouTubers. And I've got a list of say 20 or 30, because not everybody's going to be interested in, in responding to you, right? And not everybody's going to be looking for, for brand deals. So about 20 to 30, if I'm looking for maybe five, five or six. And when I'm reaching out to them, the key thing that I need to think about as a brand is it's, it's not about me in any way, shape or form.

Jake Kitchiner (13:10.944)
It's about that creator and their audience that they've worked hard to, to create. And so when I reach out to them, it's like, you know, Hey, this is something to show you that I actually am not an AI bot or whatever it is. I've actually watched your content. Like I saw your video on running where you talk about like the three different types of trainers that are really useful. you've got

You do this, you you've got to this, this many followers or you get this many audience number. We think that we can actually help you with, you know, potential video creation, give them an idea for it. Like testing out new, new trainers to see which one's the best. If that's what you want to do, that's the best way for it. And we're willing to, you know, work with you on this, this, this basis. Like, are you open to a discussion? Cause then it's all about them. It's like, here's something that's cool for your audience. There's something for you to try and we're going to, we're going to pay you. And we actually have actually looked at your content. We're not just reaching out to everybody. And then.

once they're interested in doing so, then you've got the opportunity to have the conversation and talk further about who you are, the story you're trying to get across, what's important to you as a brand. But in that first part, if you've identified a really good creator, there's possibilities that they're gonna have other people contacting them. They may or may not be interested in this type of brand deal, but if they are,

they're going to want to know, like what's, what's in it for me? How does this benefit me? Because I don't want to lose my audience by just saying, here's a really good running trainer. I want them to have an engaging piece of content where I can actually like give them some value and walk through that. And so obviously it changes depending on the type of content that you want to produce, whether it's a few shorts, whether it's like several videos or whatever it may be, but really making sure you've got the exact type of customer profile, right? That you want to target to then discover the creator.

And with that creator, when you're doing that reach out all about them, why would they do it? Why are they interested? What benefit and is it fair for them? Because you already know the benefits to you, but they don't know the benefits to them. And they've probably never heard of you either. Most of the time.

Eric (15:12.465)
Yeah, it's such simple advice, but I feel like the majority of brands don't even do this. I I know from example, I get pitched all the time for people wanting to be on my podcast. They start off the message with, we're a big fan of innovators can laugh. And they immediately go into their brand. I mean, to the person that they're pitching, the guests that they. But the thing is, they would just say, really say, we like your show and reference an episode that they heard and maybe mentioned something about that episode.

then that would resonate with me. would be open to having their guests on the show, but 99 % of them don't. They just immediately talk about their guests that they're trying to promote. And the majority of those pitches, they just go into the wastebastic. So I think it's not something that an AI bot can do. At least that's what I hear you saying, that you need to take the time to read or watch the content and just personalize the pitch.

And that way you let the creator know that we know who you are. We know the content that you create. We know what audience you have. And therefore, it's just going to resonate a lot better. And you're probably going to get a higher response rate. And I guess if you're watching their content, you kind of have an idea of where in the funnel this creator could fit. I think I saw a post that you talked about, like top and middle and bottom of the funnel.

And I thought that was very intriguing because you hear a lot of brands talk about we're doing influencer marketing, we're doing influencer marketing, but none of them really talk about how they're using creators in different parts of the funnel. Can you talk a little bit about that?

Jake Kitchiner (16:48.078)
Yeah, absolutely. And I think you're right about in terms of the AI piece is far, far less effective. And if you do the right messaging and it's personalized, you will get high level of response. I do think it can be done at scale in some cases. So if YouTubers or creators are going to be your customer, there are ways to use AI to grab a little bit of personalization, which if you're doing things, you know, five, 10, 15, 20 ,000 plus in terms of trying to acquire customers, I think

sometimes that's just more time and cost -effective to do that with a little bit of personalisation. But one -to -one brand deals, they're the ones that I'd be saving myself time and money by just doing the research up front. But yeah, there's definitely, when people are first going into influencer marketing, things that they just might not have thought of when they first go into it. It's like, want to get a creator to do this. And for most, it's like an affiliate deal.

When they're first asking, they're thinking like, we'll pay you some commission if somebody goes on to buy a product. And I think that model in itself is, dying out on its own because creators wants to get paid for their content. and then don't want to be just judged by the success of like, is this a good product or, or not? But I think the key thing when, and going into, into this question is if it's not an affiliate deal, right. You want somebody to be working on a part of the funnel.

that is most important to your, to your brand. Right. So depends where, where you are. So I keep using this running trainer example. There are top brands out there such as like Nike, Adidas, Hoka, Asics, whatever it may be, that most runners are very aware that those brands actually exist. And what they might be wanting to do with this like influencer marketing campaign is show a specific type of shoe and get people to buy that.

Right. And so in that piece of content as a, as a runner, like I'm going, okay, like these are three different trainers, or this is a pair of trainers. don't want to talk about the competition. Like here's what it does. Here's why I'm using it. And here's how, like me using it in like this competition or whatever it may, may be. But that's very different to a new trainer that is like a new, new kid on the block. And it's like, okay, we want more people to be aware of this product. So we're not going to do.

Jake Kitchiner (19:12.758)
a huge walkthrough of it. But what we are going to do is we're going to start bringing it into creators, creators videos, like in a small, small basis. it's kind of like, okay, like maybe three or three or four videos. The first one's talking about, you know, looking at all the different new trainers that I can, I can go and buy. here's all the different examples of one, like does anybody want to sponsor me and look at theirs? lo and behold, this brand have chosen me and I'm going to now like take a little bit of a look further. Okay, cool.

here's some of the things that you can do with it. And they've got all of these different ones. So I tried all of them and they were great. You should check them out. And that just has a bit of slower build up to it, but this just making more people aware that this product exists. Like I can go and try lots of their different trainers and maybe even some of my friends in the video I do collabs with potentially even talk about them. But I'm not particularly telling you to go out and buy them, just saying like, here's another brand that's out there that I've tried and I enjoyed them.

That's very different to like, if you're competing in this event, which is very specific to you, I'm getting a smaller amount of views. I'm talking to a very specific audience, but I want to drive conversions versus if you're into running, here's another brand. You might not have heard of them. I quite like them. I'm going to start trying to use them a bit more. Very different pieces of content. This one much softer and therefore less likely to turn people, turn people off, but this one higher, much more, more engaged. Like maybe if you find that ideal customer, like the right people.

higher level of conversions. But I don't think people quite always think about that. They kind of just think most of the time, like we need to do a campaign and then we will judge it by do people buy it. And we don't do that anywhere else in marketing in terms of like going from that brand awareness to buying and reconversion. So why would we do it in influencer marketing? But it's some, there's a great saying by Joss, Joss Butler, like sometimes you just have to say the obvious things. And I think that all the time, sometimes you just have to say like, which part of the funnel do you want to target? Think about that, that first.

Eric (20:49.01)
Yeah.

Eric (21:09.403)
Yeah, no, it's given me ideas on when I set up podcast campaigns on behalf of brands because there are some podcasters that are more bottom of the funnel and a specific niche and others where I know that there's not a lot of conversions, but they've got a really good audience and I think this is going to be more top of the funnel. So I'm going to start using that approach when I create my proposals and telling potential sponsors like, you know, this is where it's going to really work top and bottom and we need to have a different script.

Jake Kitchiner (21:18.517)
Mmm.

Eric (21:37.917)
for each of these podcasters in the campaign. So I love that approach. The other thing I wanted to ask you about is influencer discovery tools. know, I to get your thoughts on that. I've had a poor experience. About a year ago, I was creating a campaign, influencer campaign on behalf of a client. And I spoke to different tools and had like demos of them and phone calls with them. There were some tools that wanted like, you know, $2 ,000 a month or even $4 ,000 a month.

just to use the tool. You know, and this was just like, you know, just to find the creators that didn't even didn't even guarantee that the creators would work for work with me. And I just thought that was so ridiculous. I ended up going to Fiverr paying somebody to find, you know, influencers with specific hashtags and just manually reaching out to them one on one instead of paying this absurd amount of money for a tool. So what's your experience been like? And are there any tools out there other than channel crawler that you like?

Jake Kitchiner (22:37.07)
Well, I mean, it's kind of a nice plug for channel call, which I definitely appreciate because we're not in that. I'll go with, I understand, like I buy tech myself and the things that I always want to just know is like, does it solve my problem? And how much does it cost for me to solve that problem? Because I need to do my own ROI.

Eric (22:42.352)
You

Jake Kitchiner (23:01.774)
And sometimes I need to speak to someone or sometimes I just want to go on and try it out. Right. So that's why I like our, starts. There's a, there is a free tool that gives you a minimum amount that you can use it. There's one that's like $59 and you can go up to $195 monthly cancel anytime, but you can also speak to us too. And I think it's a buying process that allows like the two different kinds of people or the, you know, the two different types of me that's buying. Like sometimes I want to speak to somebody and sometimes I just want to try this, this thing out. And so we, we do that. think other.

created discovery tools, I think the challenge is sometimes that you have to go through that long process and you don't really know whether it's gonna solve until you've had like a call where you get asked a lot of questions and then you don't really get to see the tools, then you have another one and then it's like, no, I've been through this long process and it took a while and I wanted to start searching a while ago. So I think that's not so much a created discovery tool problem, that is just a, like a.

a process that they want people to go through. And I understand that because it gives them the opportunity to engage with people and have a conversation and try and sell them at value. But it's not where we want to be. I think there are other tools that are really good. The ones that I hear the most positive stuff about is like Creator IQ. They are much higher, more higher end in terms of cost, but the data points that they have available

There's a number of creators that they have data on that not just that they've got from public information, but privately opted into creator as well. And they make really good content too, which I think is really important for a brand within influencer marketing in the way they are. They're showing who top brands are, top successful people within influencer marketing. It's showing people how to get it done. And that comes across in the events that they host and other things.

Big shout out to them. I think that's where it's like, that's a good example of somebody charging that higher end. And they're told as more than just discovery as well. think that's the other, other piece, but yeah, I think the challenge that we run into, I won't like name any particular brands in that are out there doing it, but there's a lot of people trying to do the creative discovery piece and not doing it well and charging a lot of money. So the biggest battle is

Jake Kitchiner (25:15.158)
I often find with people when we're doing the bigger customer arms, where there's five, six, seven users, et cetera. Not so much like, should they do it or not, or should they come onto a creative discovery tool to spin up their campaigns or find customers. More just the fact, does it actually work? Is it real? Or are they going to get really annoyed in two, three weeks because the demos that I've given are all kind of like fake in a way. And this isn't quite legitimate. And so that's why we try and take.

people out the process as much as possible where customers want it, but where they do want it, we can obviously have that conversation because yeah, it just becomes a challenge and a battle. And I think the other side that for us is in one sense, a really big problem, but in one sense, great problem to have is that the churn rate is really high because you find an influencer, you have a monthly subscription, you leave the platform.

Now that obviously happens with a lot of people that do influencer marketing. They do campaigns at different times to support other things. The good thing about it though is they really like it and they come back. it's that trade off from balance. So in terms of the other tools, think one is just separating the tool from the sales process. Like does this actually solve it and is it worth the money? And if you have to go through a messy sales process, maybe that's a sign of like, it's not going to be the right ROI for you.

Eric (26:18.748)
Hahaha

Jake Kitchiner (26:37.71)
And then the other piece is like, how much more do I need it to do than discovery? Like how much would I actually use? Because one of the reasons that we pursue not to do much more at the minute than discovery is because most users tell us that that's like 90 % of what they do. And there's a lot of other features in other platforms that they don't use. We're like, cool. Okay. Well, let's focus on making this as great a search experience as possible. You can find the creators that you want. You can save them in lists. You can put them in your different places and then you can reach out to them because you've got an email there.

And so we feel like it's quite a simple formula for us. So if you are going to charge a lot more, I think you need to be more like those creator IQs that give a lot of value for free. Like I follow their content and get some value from it. And then when you pay that high ticket offer, you're getting a lot more in terms of the features, functionality, and discoverability. Because sometimes customers say to us, look, we've got the budget, and we're going to go and do that because they've got X, Y, Z. And we're like, cool. But that budget is obviously about 15, 20 times higher.

Eric (27:33.425)
Yeah, yeah, okay, agree. All right, let's get to the rapid -fire questions. Are you ready? Give me the first thing that pops into your head. Okay, when you were a kid you wanted to be blank.

Jake Kitchiner (27:39.871)
Okay.

Jake Kitchiner (27:44.44)
footballer.

Eric (27:46.971)
Craziest thing you ever did to save money or make money?

Jake Kitchiner (27:51.662)
I skydived naked in New Zealand to save on half the cost because they wanted people to do it. Yeah. I don't know why I've just said that on a podcast. feel like I've killed all credibility, but yeah, I was in New Zealand. was young. Bungee jumping costs a lot of money. So did the photos and things, but if people were willing to do it naked, they did it a lot cheaper. So I saved money on that. dear. I can't believe I've just walked through that. Yep.

Eric (27:58.237)
I'm

Eric (28:18.535)
Were you the only one that day that did this promotion?

Jake Kitchiner (28:21.004)
Yep, yep, only one. Photo, lots of people saying, my god, you're that guy. Because it's unlike one of those bus tours around New Zealand. So there's a lot of people on my bus following buses. And general public as well. So yeah, and I was the only one who decided to take them up on that offer. Towards the end of the tour, money was tighter at that point, but there you go.

Eric (28:27.452)
Yeah.

Eric (28:32.369)
Ha ha!

Eric (28:43.557)
All right. I was going to say send me a link to the video, but I don't know if my audience wants to see that video or not. So I'll leave it up to you.

Jake Kitchiner (28:49.526)
I don't think anybody wants to see it. Yeah, yeah. think I do have to, because obviously you can't put them up publicly, but I do have them saved somewhere, but I can't remember where off the top of my head.

Eric (28:59.537)
Yeah. All right. All right. That's one of the craziest things I've ever heard on this show. I think we'll go with you there. We can't really top that off, All right. Yeah, Jake, thank you so much for coming on Innovators Can Laugh. Where can people learn more about you?

Jake Kitchiner (29:05.368)
Hahaha.

Jake Kitchiner (29:10.102)
Okay, fair enough, yeah.

Jake Kitchiner (29:18.338)
Yeah, so if you want to learn more about me on LinkedIn, just drop me a connection. Always happy to chat with people. It doesn't mean that you have to want to use Channel Crawler. I'm just always happy to connect with other innovators and people doing cool things. Or if you want to check out the website, Channel Crawler, really easy. It's just channelcrawler .com.

Eric (29:35.025)
Fantastic for everybody listening. Thank you for listening to the show. Feel free to tell others about it and I'll be back next week with another entrepreneur from the UK. All right. Cheers.

Jake Kitchiner (29:46.584)
Thanks a lot.